De-lamination

Hello, I meet for some time a delamination problem.

I use Avery MPI 2000 and laminate DOL 2460 ..

The laminat holds very well on the non-printed area, When one tries to remove it, the vinyl stretches, and there is some glue of the laminate.

but on printing, he retires very easily.

We tried several profiles, several vinyl (3001, 2000, 1105,) and several laminates, but we still have the same problem.

This happens as well on dark or light prints.

The printer's supplier tells me that the inks are certified for avery vinyls, and that the problem does not come from printing.

The avery supplier tells me the vinyls are certified for latex printing, and that the problem does not come from the vinyls.

We have been using avery products and latex 360 for many years, and have never had a problem before.

I see several forums on the internet talking about the same problem.

Does HP have a solution?

thank you

#1 I suggest you to read this article: https://hplatexknowledgecenter.com/blog/hp-latex-inks-and-print-durability where is a full explanation whether lamination required, or will the application be robust enough without lamination?

Besides, it Is very important to choose the media based on the final application and then find on the same vendor the appropriate laminate for this specific media otherwise the wrong combination leads to poor adhesion or other kind of issues. So my recommendation is to choose the Avery laminate film appropriated for latex inks and appropriated for this specific media.

Just sharing some Tips and tricks to improve overlaminated SAV performance form the team:

• Media storage conditions: Make sure the SAV is stored in optimal conditions recommended by the media manufacturer to ensure the media keeps its properties as it is printed.

• Lamination speed: Ensure your lamination speed matches the one recommended by the laminate manufacturer. HP recommends setting the speed at 1 meter/minute.

• Print modes: Reducing ink density by using different profiles, reducing the number of passes, or adjusting existing profiles can also improve the output.

Follow the maximum ink densities recommended for lamination:

The substrate presets have been created in a 20⁰ C (68⁰ F) / 60% RH environment. When these ink densities are not providing appropriate curing, try the following substrate preset tweaks:

• Ink density: Reduce the ink percentage to allow a better curing performance.

• Number of passes: Increase the number of passes to provide more time for curing.

• Inter-swath delay: Increase the offset value to provide more time for curing.

• Curing temperature: If your substrate allows a higher temperature, increase it to improve curing.

• For dark colors, the use of a 4-color black rather than a straight 100% black (K) could help in certain applications.

I hope this information helps

Hello, and thank you for your return.

Obviously, we use the right profiles, the proper laminat with the vinyl, and the test prints are all good. We have been printing the printer for 4 years and have never had a problem until now.

After a discussion with our reseller HP, he offers me to make a SMK3 on the machine. But I see in the doc, that this is recommended after 110 liters of inks, while we are only at 40 liters. Could the SMK3 solve our problem?

Because I find the SMK 3 horribly expensive (971 €). And I would not want to shell out this money, without being sure that the problem will be solved.

thank you

#4 I am afraid I cannot help you this time. It is diffucult to do such a recommendation from here.

Hello, we have a Latex 560 Printer and have the same problem. We have tried different Vinyls and laminations, on unprinted areas the lamination holds very well but not on the printed areas. We have also reduced the latex optimizer but have still the same problem.

Hello Tomboy

You can apply the same Tips&Tricks that explain above, there is nothing specific for HP Latex 560 Printer. Remember that is very important to choose the media based on the final application and then find the same vendor for the appropriate laminate.

Hi Tomboy, We have a Latex 570 with the same problems. I wondering if you were able to resolve your problem with the print and laminate? If possible can you let me know how you resolved the problem. Thanks!

The SMK3 would not be necessary until you have done enough hours of work on the machine.

You would need to check: Optimiser Printhead health(use new printheads). How fresh the media and corresponding laminate is. Check dates. Based on Product Info these are suited for Latex Print.

Test optimiser and ink densities. Too much of either can affect curing and laminate adhesion.

Make a new profile based on a Generic Vinyl as a base going through all diagnostic images. Some profiles for the media from the media locator may have settings that aren't suitable such as high temperatures (you would have to do a few tests and tweaks to fine tune). You can laminate the test mages while creating the profile to make sure he laminate is working.

While it may seem like an easier method to grab the same name media profiles sometimes you may need to make some from scratch to be sure of all settings being suitable.

Here's a create new media profile guide video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KfF8W3BUw4s

Ive tried everything to stop this, including getting HP on site doing tests, its worse on darker colours, the more ink put down the worse it gets, the reason is there is a wax in the ink so the graphics won't scratch easily, (newer machines will have a separate cartridge for the wax) we made our prints better by a few things, slow the laminator down 0.75m per min, heated lamination is better, ink profiles 90/100% no more, the higher grade materials work better, we have had problems with Hexis, Arlon, Oracle, also be careful when removing a full vehicle wraps, the laminate pulls off leaving the printed vinyl still on, then breaks up in to small pieces !!!!

#10 Hi we use to print on Orafol, intercoat, Hexis, Avery, Arlon and overlaminating always with slow speed (for example 0.6m/min) and with heater on about 56 deg./Celsius (and about 40-45 degrees/Celsius for cast laminate) without further problems... When speed is higher - temp is rising also...